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PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 7:46 am 
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Can someone explain the difference between the Director and Admin Director. This is something new my church has implemented for the upcoming year and I need to know the differences in the role. If possible maybe send a link to a site, that also discusses this.

Many thanks


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 8:58 am 
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Location: Phoenix, Arizona (USA): NAD
I will look for an online explanation. The explanation is in the Pathfinder Staff Manual, every club/church needs to own at least one copy of this for their Pathfinder library where the leaders can access it all of the time.

The concept is expanded in some areas but this goes to a time when clubs were run as a Junior Club and a Teen Club.

(p. 40) The Administrative Director was the Director highest over both entities with a Teen Director and a Junior Director. In some churches today the expansion is a wrapping in of the Adventurer Program and its sub-programs as well others have two Administrative Directors, on for each of the two parent programs.

Administrative Director is a liaison between the Junior and Teen Directors

Is the Member of the Church Board representing the Pathfinder Club as a whole

Directs joint activities when the Junior and Teen Clubs meet together (the Directors then act as deputies).

Is highly experienced a guru of Pathfindering and is a counselor to the other Directors

Is the Executive Officer and President

Does NOT manage the day to day sort of details of the program but is the overall guide to the program defining its direction and broad goals with the the input of the staff and Church Board

Recruits and oversees the basic training of new staff members

Attends Club Meetings always unless death or pestilence stops him

Is a funnel for information headed to the club

Presides over regular staff meetings

Coordinates all events that involve both Junior and Teen Clubs (approves with Church Board consent all other activities)


A Junior Club Director or Teen Club Director


In most clubs this looks something like Executive Deputy or Deputy Director because most clubs meet jointly with little exception. I was the Junior Club Director and the Executive Deputy over the joint endeavor including Adventurers once upon a time. The Adventurer Director met about 4 times a year without the overall club, the Teen Club did the same. The Junior Club did not meet without the Teen Club a longer explanation than belongs here.

Is a member in good standing of the the church and a Master Guide (p.107)

A skilled leader who is an "example of spirituality, neatness, promptness, good sportsmanship, amiability, and self-control who always wears a neat and complete uniform..."

"Is vitally interested in adolescents and sympathetically understands the problems of the age."

"Resourceful and enthusiastic"... someone who takes on responsibility very seriously and follows through even when it seems impossible, someone who can make things happen.

Is a member of the Church Board

Maintain a working relationship with the Pastor, Youth Pastor, Sponsoring Elder (Yes there is supposed to be one of these). Keeps them informed and invited to what is going on, as well as keeping in touch with them about areas of concern where it involves individual kids so information can be exchanged among that kids other leaders and mentors.

Makes reports to the conference

Chairman of the staff committee for their club

Presides and club staff meetings

Supervise the activities of the club and oversee their organization or organize them

Lead out in planning the club program and calendar for the year

(8 is the detail of the above p.108)

(9 is too p.108)

Oversees club discipline and the Merit system (p. 85)


Hope this helps, if they are not online maybe Ps. Mark will be willing to scan them.

God Bless,

Chris Fishell
Xtreme Youth Resources International


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 29, 2007 8:06 pm 
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Thank you for your help. Now it has been decided that there are to be two directors. One responsible for the Friend, Companion and Explorer and the other responsible for the Ranger, Voyager and Guide. So this is a co-director position. How really do these two positions differ, and who is responsible for other aspects of the club, such as the units, and all the other duties that comes with a large club. Please again if possible direct me to documentation if possible.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 30, 2007 7:40 pm 
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Location: Phoenix, Arizona (USA): NAD
That is precisely why there is an Administrative Director in the above example. There is a Junior Club and a Teen Club divided exactly as you describe and the two directors have the responsibilities a for each full club. If the two clubs are to meet together for the general meeting then someone does need to be in charge and so...

Co-Director sounds nice, but what I think really needs to happen here is that your church board sits down with a copy of the Pathfinder Staff Manual. It does not exist by accident, if you do not have one then they need to get one at adventsource. If your church can not afford one email me, I will see what I can do. Experimenting with systems is unnecessary at this point, the system in the manual is a good one.

We always used a different system. We had a Director and an Exec. Deputy to fill all three of these positions. We then had Division Directors one for boys one for girls and one for pre-Pathfinders/Adventurers. Others would also have one for the teens/TLT but the Director loved that in our case so that was his division while I oversaw everything below.

I hope it can be worked out well. It is of the utmost importance that the organization not be left confused or it is the kids who will suffer.

God Bless,

Chris Fishell
Xtreme Youth Resources International


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:47 am 
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I think the club has a manual. Wether or not it is used, I'm not sure. I have my own personal copy which I bought in 2004, I hope the info is still relevant. I have been reading it since december. I've been put in charge of the older Pathfinders 13-15. I don't think there are too many of them so this should work out fine. I was looking at the organizational chart for the TLT. So If I understand this correctly....this is like a tiny club within a big club with its own set of counselors/Instructors Secretary and treasurer? Can I make one of my guide/ voyager the deputy directory on each side of the units? They already have additional responsibilites such as that of drilling/Drum corp instructor. Each of the unit will then have their own Jr counselor, captain, scribe etc.

Then when the entire club gets together as a whole there will also be unit formation? Do I understand that correctly? A comment was made that the Admin director is an assistant to the two co-directors. I really don't understand it to be so, but please clarify.

Also I've been asked to be the secretary for the entire club. I think this will be a big responsibility along with being the Director of the Teen club which will include being the TLT director. There just isn't any qualified individuals able to take on such a position. So I think I would do this for the first three months and train one of the teens/MIT's to take over after that.

Also both Jr and Teen club will meet on the same day and time. Are we to begin the club together as a whole in units to go through the preliminaries then separate to do classwork/jr & teen club after that then resume together again at the end of the day for closing exercises?


Ok, what about the monthly report that is sent in to the conference. Should this be filled out as a whole or should it be separated to reflect the activities of each of the two seperate clubs? I think our section will be doing alot more.

Sorry I have alot of questions that I need answered before registation on the weekend.

Many thanks for your continued support.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 2:38 pm 
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No need to be sorry for asking questions. In fact that is the point to ask questions and become informed. Please, forgive me if I seem to come on strong, it is hard to convey tone in writing and challenge to mentor a club from a distance. I am sure you will be successful and I (and others) will be happy to help you work out the "kinks."

this is like a tiny club within a big club with its own set of counselors/Instructors Secretary and treasurer?

That is a reasonable analogy. Consider the TLT to be a learning track for overall leadership. It is the framework used to accomplish the upper Class Levels. The TLT's exist within the larger club in two forms: 1) Teen Pathfinders, 2) Leaders in Training. Not all Teen Pathfinders are always TLT's or MIT if you are using a variant program but most are.

Can I make one of my guide/ voyager the deputy directory on each side of the units?

May be you know that I was the Executive Deputy for an entire club in my teens (13 to be exact) and that Pathfinders was a Director at 15. We are not unique cases. If you have teens that are skilled enough for this level of responsibility now then you can make them deputy/associate/division directors whatever title you choose. There is one short fall unless they are 25 they can not drive others in club related matters and unless they are 18 they can be the adult supervision at any event which means you or another adult must always be present.

Then when the entire club gets together as a whole there will also be unit formation?


Yes, any teen not assigned as an assistant counselor or director will fall in as the member of a unit even if he has a duty with the secretary or other position. In formation Assistant counselors stand next to the unity counselor behind the unit and deputies flank the Director on their appropriate sides.

A comment was made that the Admin director is an assistant to the two co-directors. I really don't understand it to be so, but please clarify.

Did I say assistant or did the manual? The admin Director is the overall visionary for the club. The duty is to see that every staff member plays nice together, liability policies are met, lobby the church board, recruit and train staff... In many ways this is an assistant to the club directors. This position relieves many of the responsibilities from the directors that would keep them from being 'hands on' with the actual execution of club activities and with the teaching of the kids.

So I think I would do this for the first three months and train one of the teens/MIT's to take over after that.

The majority of this position's responsibilities should go to a teen. It is actually a fairly straight forward duty if kept up with and not combined with treasurer. You should always be actively checking the completeness and accuracy of the work.

Also both Jr and Teen club will meet on the same day and time. Are we to begin the club together as a whole in units to go through the preliminaries then separate to do classwork/jr & teen club after that then resume together again at the end of the day for closing exercises?

Exactly correct. This is why there is normally one big boss leader. You will need to decide among you who will normally lead out in these situations as the Director (in an order of succession this would normally be the Teen director in the absence of an Admin. Director) This will be a normal thing and the program should begin and end identically most nights and some nights with special guests they will not separate at all. In the absence of one director another must be prepared to take over.

what about the monthly report that is sent in to the conference. Should this be filled out as a whole or should it be separated to reflect the activities of each of the two separate clubs?

No, in the eyes of the conference you will be one club unless you get two certificates of operation (charters) do not do that. Be one club, the teens need to junior to work with and teach so they will be strong leaders and the juniors need the peer role models in the teens.

It is expected that the teens will do more independent activities than juniors this is why many decades ago the system was established separating teens and juniors. Remember that in your reporting it is not a club activity if it is only a teen or only a junior activity. It is a division or unit activity if it is a smaller group. This depends slightly on your conference but your standing depends on participation and if you report a teen activity as a club activity you will be 75% absent when you make the report.

All club activities with junior and teen (like camping or zoo trips) should be planned at least one time per 3 months leaving many weekends for the smaller segments to do other activities. You should be planning no fewer than one activity (weekend) of some kind per month and no more than three. Some will be a few hours such as a fundraiser, others a day like community service and the fewest full weekends like camping.

God Bless,

Keep the questions coming,

Chris


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